A vaild point...

[DPawlak]

from the iRacing forum. This is exactly how i feel about paying to race and buying content.

>Boy, lately it seems like other sim racers that choose to hate iRacing really trash on the game, mainly for the cost and other reasons, They say you will never own the content. So say if you have $500 dollars invested in the 1st year, although you will not own the content, you have had 12 months of entertainment for less than cable TV. Another sim racer posted it this way, It's like fuel for your boat, at the end of the season you just have the memories. I just cant see why so many choose to Hate iracing so much. Has anyone else seen this on other forums? Don't get me wrong, they have a valid point about not owning the content, but do you ever own Cable TV service? "

Dave

 

[waltrip55]

no one want to pay 500 a year
i brought papy racing game at $100.00
had it for 6 years so i will never buy iracing
to much money
and buy the way once iracing goes down there goes your $2000.00
down the drain

 

[DPawlak]

no one want to pay 500 a year
i brought papy racing game at $100.00
had it for 6 years so i will never buy iracing
to much money
and buy the way once iracing goes down there goes your $2000.00
down the drain

Yes... reminds of a saying..

Nothing cheap is good, nothing good is cheap.

 

[Kevin_McAdams]

Once I get the money for iRacing, I'm going to be fully committed. It's like every other hobby, you spend the money you think needs to be spent to enjoy yourself to the fullest. Sure I spent $20 for Nr2003, but it's an old outdated game with only 4 physics styles. iRacing is definitely more than that. And I don't think iRacing will be beat anytime soon, because they can update their software anytime they want.

 

[Daniel Gomez]

Yes... reminds of a saying..

Nothing cheap is good, nothing good is cheap.

well depends !
nr2003 is cheap n is AWESOME to me !

 

[TCooper]

Not that cheap, for a game that's more than 6 years old.
And what are there, like 10 leagues that still run it?

 

[SkynyrdsByrd83]

i like both the same, if john henry and dave kramer werent nazis about the 2k3 physics id still be at 2k3 but i have spent 156 dollars for a monthly subscription which you get 85 for renewing your subscription which i did, and i bought nothing but tracks with that, except the 30 i spent for latemodels

 

[MattSRD28]

Don't get me wrong, they have a valid point about not owning the content, but do you ever own Cable TV service? "

Actually, yes. When I record programs onto DVD via my recording, I now own the recording. 70% of my DVD library has been created in this manner.

 

[SkynyrdsByrd83]

i watch my tv on my comp, stickin it to the man. i just watch the office and races anyway tho

 

[JMH714]

From what I see: there are no wrongs on both sides - one side has point and other side also has a point. The debate will always argue for long time. Both sides will go extreme to prove other side wrong which there is none.

 

[Enter Sandman]

I thought iracing to be great, but I know the investment isn't worth it for me at this point in time. I haven't even gotten a chance to fire up gimp this week to paint, let alone race something I'm paying for.

It's a ton of fun, but real life has to take priority and I haven't even had enough time to so things I enjoy for free lately. Hopefully down the road I'll be able to get back on there.

 

[DPawlak]

I can understand if you can't afford it... just the guys that say it sucks because you have to pay and haven't tried it gets to me.

Perhaps if times were a bit different with the econmy we wouldn't be hearing so much crap about the cost. Had iRacing/Papyrus started using this same pricing structure 10 years ago for GPL and later N2003, I think we all would have paid it and then some. I think a lot of us were all very spoiled by GPL and N2003, two fantastic simulations that we all paid about $50 for and got 5-10 years worth of use out of them. With constant mods, new tracks, leagues, etc. So I agree that there is a very big sense of entitlement amongst a lot of people, and that really puts them off when they see the pricing structure of iRacing.


I also think since the hacking and cheating is probably next to none, some guys just won't be good at it and it will show.

dave

 

[B.McKeever]

In my view, it's like a gym membership.

$1,000 can buy you exercise equipment.

$50 / month can buy you a gym membership.

So after two years, you're paying more for that membership than you paid for your piece of equipment, right?

Well think of it this way: Who maintains and repairs / pays for repairs on your personal gym equipment?
Who maintains and repairs / pays for repairs on the gym's equipment?

In the long run, it may be more expensive to go to that gym but the utility of cost (how much you're willing to pay for a good/service) is worth it. I, for one, would rather let someone else repair the gym equipment than have to buy expensive parts and spend my time to fix my own equipment.

Another good saying: "To each his own."

If I had the internet connection, video card, and the steady (stable) income I would be on iRacing nightly. I believe it is def. worth the expense because they maintain the game and update it and all you do is boot and play. NR2k3 can only be updated so much and if a program causes the game to crash or the CD gets broken, it's all on you, bud.

Just my $0.02
:arghh:

 

[MattSRD28]

Perhaps if times were a bit different with the econmy we wouldn't be hearing so much crap about the cost.

Doubt it. People were having the same kinds of objections to the cost structure long before iRacing actually existed.

Had iRacing/Papyrus started using this same pricing structure 10 years ago for GPL and later N2003, I think we all would have paid it and then some. I think a lot of us were all very spoiled by GPL and N2003, two fantastic simulations that we all paid about $50 for and got 5-10 years worth of use out of them. With constant mods, new tracks, leagues, etc. So I agree that there is a very big sense of entitlement amongst a lot of people, and that really puts them off when they see the pricing structure of iRacing.

I'm going to have to disagree with this too.

Yes we are very spoiled by how well NR2003 was made, but let's face it, Papyrus made NR2003 so we could use it for this long since they knew they wouldn't be able to make a game as long as the EA contract was valid.

Whenever I hear complaints about the price structure, I rarely if ever hear a complaint that doesn't include displeasure with how high the cost is. Sure NR2003 being free is there, but even if it wasn't, and I say this because people seem to be accepting of having to pay money just not that much, I think people would still complain and elect not to pay the money iRacing is asking for.

Furthermore, I do not believe that not having actually played iRacing before invalidates the complaint. Walt Disney World just raised their ticket prices to $79 for 1 day. $79!!! Now, does someone really need to have visited a WDW park just to have a valid beef with paying that much? IMO, no. People generally know what visiting a theme park is like, just like people generally know what playing a racing game is like. Your mileage may vary of course, but people base their judgement on that general understanding, and many people judge iRacing's cost as just too high.

Doesn't do any good really to get frustrated/complain about people complaining about the price simply because YOU have a different opinion. Different strokes for different folks. Understand it, get over it, do whatever you need to do, but there's absolutely no need to piss on everyone else's NR2003 parade simply because YOU enjoy iRacing's product and have no problem paying the price for it.

 

[MONSTARR]

i would be on iracing every night if i wasnt going to college, playing football therefore cant work much, and racing sprint cars on the weekend. i just cant get the funds going for iracing. but this being said people will generally turn to nr2003 because A. its free!! B. You can drive for the most part the same cars as on iracing C. You can use everyt track on the circuit and not have to pay for them.

 

[SteveJ37]

Matt, considering the fact you have never tryed iRacing you can not even have an opinion on it . iRacing is very different then other sim's and the one thing that gets me is when people dislike iRacing but have never bothered to at least try the free 1 month subscription.

YOU can't say you don't enjoy it when you haven't even tryed it. If you have used iRacing and don't like it, I'll respect your opinion but you haven't.

Also, NR2003 is not free and anyone getting the game free is perform an illegal action. I payed $75 for mine a few years ago.

 

[JMH714]

There's a free month trail? I don't think I have seen it.

 

[marcusl26]

I respect people's opinion the pricing. Obviously, after years of receiving good simulations for a one time fee people are going to be swayed by the fact that iRacing costs a monthly fee, and on top of that have to pay for content. The fact that people believe other sims are free and the ability to race online for free is misleading. Yes, a lot of people pay for their sims for a one time fee, but nowadays since Nr2003 is pretty much unobtainable for less than $100 most people decide to torrent it, which gives them the impression that it is "free". A lot of people also rent servers to host online, yes some can host themselves for free, but a lot of the online servers are being paid for by someone. Just because we have been blessed with the ability to race online for free doesn't mean it's free for everyone.

Yes, I agree iRacing is expensive in terms of it being a game/simulation, but I respectfully disagree on the fact that you can solidly judge a product's price-to-sanctification ratio if you haven't tried the product and are solely going off of the price. Just because a steak dinner costs twice as much as a fast food meal doesn't mean that the steak dinner costs too much, it just means it's different than the cheaper alternative. Everyone's tastes are different, but just because you are satisfied with fast food doesn't mean anyone who eats the steak dinner is frivolous, it just means they like different things. Some people may like Nr2003's "free races", while others prefer to pay for a sanctioned body of racing a system, which holds people accountable. It's more of a matter of personal preference than anything.

I wouldn't judge a book by it's cover and I wouldn't judge a sim just by the price it charges. If someone is to try it and find that it doesn't suit them then that's fine, but I wouldn't say they are charging too much until I have actually seen what I get in return before judging the price to satisfaction factor. Just my $.02.

*Sorry for all of the cliches and analogies.
**Yes, Radical offers a free one month trial along with Silverstone and the Radical SR8.

 

[DPawlak]

Doubt it. People were having the same kinds of objections to the cost structure long before iRacing actually existed.



I'm going to have to disagree with this too.

Yes we are very spoiled by how well NR2003 was made, but let's face it, Papyrus made NR2003 so we could use it for this long since they knew they wouldn't be able to make a game as long as the EA contract was valid.

Whenever I hear complaints about the price structure, I rarely if ever hear a complaint that doesn't include displeasure with how high the cost is. Sure NR2003 being free is there, but even if it wasn't, and I say this because people seem to be accepting of having to pay money just not that much, I think people would still complain and elect not to pay the money iRacing is asking for.

Furthermore, I do not believe that not having actually played iRacing before invalidates the complaint. Walt Disney World just raised their ticket prices to $79 for 1 day. $79!!! Now, does someone really need to have visited a WDW park just to have a valid beef with paying that much? IMO, no. People generally know what visiting a theme park is like, just like people generally know what playing a racing game is like. Your mileage may vary of course, but people base their judgement on that general understanding, and many people judge iRacing's cost as just too high.

Doesn't do any good really to get frustrated/complain about people complaining about the price simply because YOU have a different opinion. Different strokes for different folks. Understand it, get over it, do whatever you need to do, but there's absolutely no need to piss on everyone else's NR2003 parade simply because YOU enjoy iRacing's product and have no problem paying the price for it.

That's fine... my opinion is my opinion. Never said anyone else is wrong. Bottom line... if you don't like the price of something don't buy it. Simple. If I buy a iRacing car 0r a track for $15.00 and run in for ten years like N2003 will be before it gets real old, I would have enjoyed it for that long for a cost of 0.004109589041095890410958904109589 cents a day. Hardly a piggy bank buster.

but to believe Papyrus made to N2003 to play for a long time is ludicrous...

Dave

 

[MattSRD28]

Matt, considering the fact you have never tryed iRacing you can not even have an opinion on it . iRacing is very different then other sim's and the one thing that gets me is when people dislike iRacing but have never bothered to at least try the free 1 month subscription.

Steve, I think you missed the mark a bit here. I wasn't giving an opinion about the game, I was talking about how it's totally possible to have an opinion about iRacing's pricing structure without having played iRacing. iRacing users can disagree, as people do when it comes from matters of opinion, but I see no reason at all why opinions about the pricing structure must pass a litmus test of some amount of gameplay to become valid.

YOU can't say you don't enjoy it when you haven't even tryed it. If you have used iRacing and don't like it, I'll respect your opinion but you haven't.

Well first I never said I didn't enjoy iRacing. That would be kinda hard to say since I've never actually played it. Iif I do play it some day I'll let you know what I think. Thus far I'm pretty sure the only opinion I have given about iRacing is that it's simply priced too high for me and others. Again, you might think it's worth your money, but it comes down to a matter of opinion & perception.

I'm having the same kinds of discussions in another realm of fandom because Premium Annual Passes to Disneyland just got hiked up to $429. There are opinions all across the board about that, and that's totally cool. I don't have a problem when someone who doesn't go to Disneyland all that often, if ever, because they feel like that's simply too much money to spend. I can go on forever trying to say that the $429 AP is worth the money, but I'm not trying to invalidate their opinion because they haven't gone in x amount of time if at all. People make the choices they will, and life goes on.

Does that make more sense?

Also, NR2003 is not free and anyone getting the game free is perform an illegal action. I payed $75 for mine a few years ago.

Well obviously the base game isn't free. I wasn't trying to imply that it was. When people talk about NR2003's being free, they're referring to all the free downloads on the 'net that bring a 2003 game mostly up to speed with 2009.

but to believe Papyrus made to N2003 to play for a long time is ludicrous...

Why? Papy deliberately made NR2003 as customizeable a mod-able as they did because they intended for the sim community to make stuff that would extend its life through the duration of the EA contract. No NASCAR Racing game was as easy to make stuff for as NR2003 was. Not NR2, NR3, NR4, or NR2002. When NR2003 came out, people were almost beside themselves about all the new possibilities. Those are facts. Where's the ludicrousness?

Never said anyone else is wrong.

Oh, but you imply it every chance you get. From demeaning NR2003 itself to implying that anyone who'd choose it over iRacing is some Neandertal who out of stupidity would pass on iRacing for the NR2003 dinosaur, you consistently hammer it home over & over again, and it's just unnecessary. You win more flies with honey than you do vinegar. If you believe iRacing is the better game, fine, but as I said, there's no reason at all to piss on everyone else's NR2003 parade because YOU don't like it anymore.